Show notes:
This week on the podcast I’m chatting to Zoe Burke, the global head of brand content and social at Bridebook. We delved into the complexities that couples face when navigating the of options available to them. Drawing from her extensive experience in the wedding industry, Zoe emphasises the importance of personalisation and the evolving role of directories in facilitating vendor selection.
Time stamps:
00:02 – Navigating the Wedding Planning Process
00:37 – The Journey into the Wedding Industry
16:39 – Understanding the Modern Wedding Directory Landscape
27:21 – Understanding Couples’ Expectations in Wedding Planning
38:18 – The Importance of Personal Connection in Marketing
Transcipt:
Zoe
00:00:00.160 – 00:00:13.440
The route to planning a wedding is not linear. Right? The route to booking your vendors is not linear. And I’ve seen this. I’ve done this. I’m in my 15th year now.
I have seen it from when people would just go on a directory and bam, bam, bam, book everything. But things have changed.
Becca
00:00:13.760 – 00:01:01.180
I’m Becca Poutney, wedding business marketing expert, speaker and blogger, and you’re listening to the Wedding Pros who Are Ready to Grow podcast. I’m here to share with you actionable tips, strategies and real life examples to help you take your wedding business to the next level.
If you are an ambitious wedding business owner that wants to take your passion and use it to build a profitable, sustainable business doing what you love, then you’re in the right place. Let’s get going with today’s episode. Today I’m chatting with Zoe Burke, global head of brand content and social at Bridebook.
Having worked in the industry for the last 14 years, she’s become a leading voice, particularly in the digital space. She has a huge amount of knowledge and experience to share and I cannot wait to get to know her better myself. Zoe, welcome to the podcast.
Zoe
00:01:01.430 – 00:01:02.230
Thank you for having me.
Becca
00:01:02.390 – 00:01:17.550
It’s an absolute pleasure. I was just saying before we hit record that we’ve existed or coexisted in this industry for a long time and yet our paths have never really crossed.
So I’m really excited to have this conversation to get to know you better and to find out more about your new role today.
Zoe
00:01:17.550 – 00:01:19.950
Yeah, I’m really excited to be here. I can’t wait to get stuck in.
Becca
00:01:19.950 – 00:01:32.230
It’s going to be a good conversation.
But before we get into the now, I love to go back and I always ask people, what was the first thing that you did that landed you in this wild world of weddings? Way back.
Zoe
00:01:32.310 – 00:02:38.080
Gosh. Okay, this is big question.
So I was at University from 2009 to 2012, and most people who were around in that time will know it was a big global credit crunch, big dire financial news worldwide. And I was doing a journalism degree and all of our journalism lecturers would tell us, you’ll be lucky to get a job.
To be honest, only a few of you are going to get a job in this industry. To be honest, you’re going to have to really want it. And I did really want it. I did a lot of internships, I did a lot of work experience.
I worked really hard. When I left university, I applied, applied for 87 jobs. I’ve still got the notebook in my desk drawer where I would write down by hand.
Every job I applied for, whether I heard back from them, interview what I needed to do, etc. One of those jobs was an internship at a company called Hitch. It was a year long internship. I think the salary was 12 grand.
And it sounds like it’s 1912, doesn’t it? Not 2012. And I got an interview there and I got the job.
And I actually, out of those 87 applications, had two interviews, one for Southampton Airport and one for Hitch. So I could have been an airport expert if things had gone differently. Wow.
Becca
00:02:38.080 – 00:03:15.700
And what a lesson in going for what you want. 87 Jobs is insane. I mean, my background’s also media. I did a television degree and so my lecturers told me the same thing.
If you want it, you’ve really got to want it, otherwise you’re not going to get the job. And it was the people that went after it and tried absolutely everything, which it sounds like you did, who found success.
And we’re glad that you landed in the wedding industry and not in aviation, selling holidays or airport marketing. It’s a bit of a different journey. So you started at Hitched as an intern.
So now walk me briefly through how you’ve gone from an intern at Hitched and then all these later to this fancy job title at Bride book that I mentioned at the start.
Zoe
00:03:15.700 – 00:04:38.690
Well, yeah, so I took the job. I was a little, not like disappointed, that’s the wrong word. But I was underwhelmed. It was an industrial estate in Camberley in Surrey.
It was a tiny little office, about 12 people work there. Everyone was a little bit older than me, so they all would go home at the end of the day to their husbands, wives, kids. I had none of that was 21.
And it was. I just thought, oh, this isn’t. I’ll do it for a year and then I’ll, you know, move on to something else.
But the longer I spent there, the more I got to know people. I really started to get on with them. I really enjoyed it. I worked really hard.
I built out relationships with the people who founded the business, Dean and Darren, and kind of proved my worth and they kept me on. And I remember thinking, okay, I’ll stay a bit longer and then I’ll go to Cosmo or Stylist or whatever, but I’ll stay just a bit longer.
And then the further I got into it, the more I would look at what the editor at the time was doing and think I would do that differently or if I got to be editor, I’d do it like this. And over time realized I wasn’t ever going to go anywhere else. I loved it where I was, so I stayed with Hitch for five years.
Then I went over to Ocean Media, who do national wedding show, Bridal buyer. Part of my job there was to relaunch Confetti, which was really exciting. And we launched the print magazine too, which was really fun.
And then I went back to Hitch again for another five years, this time as editor, and then I ended up here at Bride Book. So, yeah, I’ve kind of jumped around a little bit.
Becca
00:04:38.690 – 00:04:58.850
Yeah, you’ve been all over the place and I love that because this wedding industry, it gets you. You say, yeah, I’m just going to do it for a year.
And then here you are all of these years later, still loving the wedding industry and having worked for all these different groups. And the thing is, people don’t often know at that level. Groups merge, groups change. So Ocean Media don’t even run the national wedding show anymore.
Zoe
00:04:59.490 – 00:05:00.090
They don’t.
Becca
00:05:00.090 – 00:05:18.110
It all change. But you’ve seen it all and Confetti’s been bought out.
You know, there’s all these different things that have gone on in the industry, but you’ve kind of been a part of all of those different areas. You have a big understanding. And here you are in 2026 at Bride Book. So just talk me through what your role is now in Bride Book.
Zoe
00:05:18.110 – 00:06:00.330
Yes, it’s a big signing role, Global head of brand, content and social. So I’m looking after a lot. I’m really excited to be doing it because it’s something I’m really passionate about.
How a brand is perceived, where it shows up, what it stands for. Those things are all really important to me. Content is my background and my passion.
I’ve done a lot of PR work in the last sort of five years, so I’m bringing that experience over to Bridebook and we are looking at how we kind of level up the brand, get it in even more places, help even more couples get married. Because Bright book is celebrating 10 years this year, which is really exciting.
So I’m very, very thrilled to be part of the team for such a big milestone anniversary.
Becca
00:06:00.330 – 00:06:02.250
That’s exciting. You having a big party or anything.
Zoe
00:06:02.250 – 00:06:05.910
To celebrate, pushing hard for. I am pushing hard.
Becca
00:06:05.910 – 00:06:29.750
All right, well, let me know, because I also remember when Bride book launched 10 years ago, because it was 10 years ago that I launched the consultancy part of my business. And I’ve seen BrideBook from day one grow into what it is now.
But if people listening don’t know, maybe they’re from outside the UK or they just haven’t really heard about what Bride Book is from a business perspective for a supplier. What is Bride Book? How can it help them?
Zoe
00:06:29.750 – 00:07:41.260
So Bride Book’s really unique because it was started by somebody who runs a wedding business, whereas, you know, Hitch was started by someone who got married. Married and actually, funny fact, started by somebody who realized there was no space for people to upload their speeches. That’s how Hitch started.
Bride Book was started because Hamish, the founder, he and heads the house, which is a very well known wedding venue, realized that he wasn’t getting what he wanted from other wedding directory platforms and that as a business, he could see a real gap in the market for, you know, he knew exactly what a venue wanted to see when they logged into these platforms. So he set up his own app, Bride Book, to help businesses. And I think that’s still very much the heart of what Bride Book does.
It is about the businesses. Obviously we love the couples too, but, you know, the couples come and go, the businesses stay with you.
So they are our priority at Bright Book and we try and make sure that everything is really intuitive for businesses. You’ve got so much information. It’s really a tool to help you with your marketing rather than just a place to list your business.
And it’s a really popular app. It’s the UK’s number one wedding planning app. It’s been rated number one by the app Store. It’s got a lot of great testimonials too.
Becca
00:07:41.260 – 00:07:57.980
Amazing. So do you think then in 2026, because I’ve been talking a lot about the marketing landscape, how things are shifting.
We’ve seen all this technological change. Are directories still relevant right now for the small wedding business owners, the photographers, the florists, or even the venues?
Zoe
00:07:58.060 – 00:09:50.700
Yes, I absolutely think so. Because the route to planning a wedding is not linear, right? The route to booking your vendors is not linear.
And I’ve seen this, I’ve done this, I’m in my 50s, 15th year now. I have seen it from when people would just go on a directory and bam, bam, bam, book everything. But things have changed.
You know, social media has come a long way. You start looking at one type of thing, you know, maybe like you like a rustic post, suddenly all you get is rustic post. You.
Your businesses are much more savvy with how they promote themselves on SEO and social. And for the average couple, they’re just overwhelmed. There’s so much out there.
But I think directories still play such a key Part because in this age where you can get everything and anything instantly and there’s so much choice, what couples are really looking for is verification. Does this vendor match up across all these platforms?
Can I see reviews compiled in one place that aren’t just, you know, the ones they’ve chosen for their website? So I think it’s so important for vendors to have a really up to date, brilliant website, really consistent, cohesive social media.
Pick a brand tone and stick with it so it doesn’t feel disjointed. And make sure it’s replicated across everything you do.
And I’m not saying you should list on every single directory because that’s way too much admin, particularly for small businesses. But pick one or two that really align with who you are and what your business values are and what type of couples you want.
You know, there are some vendors that cater to more alternative couples and weddings, so you probably want to find a directory that aligns with that. You know, if you are a specialist in like goth, motorbike, undead weddings, you are probably not going to find your typical couple on bride book.
But if you are a little bit more mainstream, you know, you’re catering to the masses, then one of the more mainstream directories is probably better for you and you make sure it’s fully up to date, it’s consistent with your web, your social, and that you’ve got reviews coming in on there as well. Because I think it’s no longer a direct route to booking, as I say, but it is part of that like benchmarking and checking process.
Becca
00:09:51.180 – 00:10:38.610
Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
So what we’re seeing then is it’s part of a broader picture and I see it from a marketing perspective because it used to be, and I’ve been talking about, you know, the marketing funnel, it used to be very linear.
And so we used to see directories as a place where someone would find us and then immediately inquire with us and then maybe we would or wouldn’t convert the booking.
But actually now what I’m saying is that the marketing landscape is like a theme park is wild out there, people are all over the place and actually that linear route isn’t there anymore.
And it may be that a couple looks on a directory for social proof, they might look at any of the directories, find you on there and then they go and look at your website and then they go and look at your social media, then they do their whole research journey and, and then they might contact you directly. So it’s really difficult for people to pinpoint the roi. Isn’t it on their directory listings?
Zoe
00:10:38.610 – 00:10:44.250
Absolutely, yeah, it is. It’s for any Midlands listeners. Spaghetti junction type vibes.
Becca
00:10:44.810 – 00:10:57.650
Yeah, it’s absolute chaos out there.
So when you look at the people who are doing well on directories, so whatever sector of the market they’re in, what do you think it is that they do which makes that marketing tool work for them?
Zoe
00:10:57.650 – 00:12:18.340
They treat their directory like an extension of their brand, they treat it like another social media channel, you know, updating it with fresh images, they’re being selective about which images they use, they are making sure they’ve got up to date reviews on there, they’re keeping it updated with fresh information.
You know, I’ve seen, I don’t want to guess how many listings I’ve seen over the years, but I’ve seen some that still have photos on from, you know, 2006.
And you will remember the crispy curly updos of 2006 and the blue and white silk flowers and all that sort of stuff, stuff that really dates your imagery to its, its time. And they’ve still got that fairly prominent on their listings. And I think that’s not going to convert today’s couples.
You need, you need to treat it with as much care as you would your Instagram page, making sure it’s presenting a curated, elegant version of what you offer, making sure it’s consistent with all your other platforms as well.
Because if you see an Instagram post and you love it and you think, oh, this could be my photographer, and then you’re doing your research, you’re doing your social proof checking and you go to a listing and you just see the crispy curls and the stretchy chair covers and things.
It could lose you, that inquiry, wherever it was going to come through in the end, because it’s not consistent and they can’t trust you because they can’t see a unified approach across all your platforms.
Becca
00:12:18.340 – 00:12:45.700
Yeah, makes perfect sense.
And I think one of the things that I see is that people make a decision to list with a directory, they pay their money up front, they set it up very quickly and then they just leave it there. And then a year later, when it comes to renew, they go, oh, this didn’t do anything for me.
But actually, they haven’t made the most of that through the year. So with Bright Book, do they get an account manager if they do that? And three months in they think, this isn’t working for me.
Is there someone they can go to and get help to make it work better?
Zoe
00:12:45.860 – 00:13:57.380
Yeah, we have account managers. We have a support, a customer support team as well. And we also have a really great B2B resource, which is part of the thing you pay for as well.
You know, that’s the other thing that I think directories do now that’s different back in the day is you’re not just paying for your advertising, but you’re paying for support from the experts as well. So we have a whole B2B section with webinars and articles and things that you can access to support your business.
And one of the things I did, it was week two, I sent an email out to all the vendors that we’re in touch with across the board. Whether you’re listed or not, we’ve got your consent to contact you. We contacted you and I said, hey, here I am. It’s me. Contact me. Here’s my email.
Chat to me because it’s really important to me that I hear from the people that I’m going to be working with. And I’ve had a lot of vendors come back to me, tell me what they want to see more of what they need.
And I’m working with the B2B team on a plan to put that in place as well. So I think that is kind of also included in those fees that you pay to a directory that you’re getting that support.
And it’s very important to me particularly that I’m able to speak to people directly, get an idea of what they want and make that happen. Because otherwise, like, what’s the point?
Becca
00:13:57.620 – 00:14:19.190
Yeah, I agree. And I think it’s really important that people take action on that and also realize that the opportunities are there.
I think sometimes these directories or these big companies can feel faceless and they can feel scared. They think, oh, if I contact that they’ll just be trying to sell me something else or they’ll try and fob me off.
So I think, understanding, if you’re asking for feedback, you genuinely are happy to receive it.
Zoe
00:14:19.190 – 00:14:39.710
Yeah, I really am. I want to hear from people.
And, you know, I think I’ve been around long enough that quite a lot of people know me and they don’t feel afraid to talk to me if anyone ever did. Don’t, please. I’m. I’m always happy to have a chat, always happy to listen. You don’t have to be a paying member of Bright Book to talk to me.
You can chat to me anytime. I’m, I’m here and I want to hear it.
Becca
00:14:40.050 – 00:15:34.870
Yeah, that’s great to hear.
And I think the thing Is I think what we want to see in this industry, and it seems like that’s what you’re embracing now in your role at Bridebook, is that all of these directories, all of these consultants, all of us want the best for people. So we don’t want people to spend money on something that’s not going to work for them. We don’t want to trick them into spending money.
We actually just want to provide solutions which are going to help and also be open to pointing them in a different direction if this isn’t the solution for them. Like you said with some of the alternative vendors, maybe Bride Book or these platforms aren’t the right choice for them.
And I think it’s understanding we can have a bit more trust because again, going back eight, 10 years, a lot of that trust was eroded away and then it’s been built back up and then things happen. Other people in the industry don’t do such great stuff. And then all of a sudden it’s really hard to build that trust up again.
Do you sometimes feel on the difficult side of that battle?
Zoe
00:15:35.170 – 00:16:30.140
Oh, yeah, absolutely. And, you know, I. People don’t hold back when they tell me what they think of directories or brands I work with or whatever.
And I don’t mind because everybody’s entitled to their own opinion. And at this grand age, I don’t take it personally anymore. But I am like, what I am personally committed to is the wedding industry.
Like, I’ve spent too many years in my life doing this to not make it the best it can be, you know, and to have the media malign it with the wedding tax notion and all that kind of stuff. And I’m always pushing back against that. And my.
My main premise, any brand I work at, I say to people, what we’re here to do is empower businesses and educate couples. That’s the crux of it. And that is what I will continue to do.
So any feedback from businesses or from couples that I can be given, I will fold that into my mission to educate and empower.
Becca
00:16:30.140 – 00:16:53.700
That’s great to hear.
Let’s think about data for a second in terms of people’s return on investment, because we’ve just said that it’s actually really difficult for people now to measure that return on investment.
If there is someone listening, that’s listing on your directory, another directory, and they are trying to work out whether or not it’s doing anything for them. Is there certain markers they should be looking for? Is there certain stats they should be paying attention to, what data should they be looking at?
Zoe
00:16:53.700 – 00:18:34.110
Yeah. So there’s a few different ways to do this. Brightbook actually has such a great dashboard.
Like my mind was blown when I joined joined and I got to have a look at it. You get access to all this information, including like lost lead data.
So you can see if someone inquired with you and then went with another business, you can see where you lost the lead to. So you can have a look to see what they’ve done differently to you.
There’s also, as I say, a lot of resources and things in there as well to help you. But that lost lead data, like really blew my mind.
There’s also a really great tracking system in the back end, so you can see, you know, how many people have viewed your profile, who’s viewed it. You have Power Match where you can reach out to people who have viewed your profile as well.
You can import bookings from other places into your CMS to keep it all together. CRM, I should say. And then also we have a new showround tool for venues as well.
So you can book show rounds directly through Bribe Book now, which is really nice. I think it’s really helpful for that conversion.
But outside of like looking at how many people have viewed your profile, I would also say wherever you book a couple, don’t assume that’s the only place they found you and perhaps include at some point, whether it’s just a casual ask when you’re talking to them or whether you send them a little survey, which places have you seen us on?
And you know, it’s never going to be an exact science, but you can measure, you know, okay, 50% of these people who have booked us have said they’ve also seen us on Bride Book. Our visibility is clearly working there. That kind of thing should really help. And it will help you know where to focus your energy as well.
Because if you can see that almost nobody is looking at you from social media, maybe you need to spend a bit more time building that up.
Becca
00:18:34.110 – 00:19:09.180
Yeah, and it’s not the sexiest part of business, but I talk about it a lot.
I say you’ve got to look at your data, you’ve got to understand where people are coming from because otherwise you’re just taking shots in the dark or going on your gut feel.
And I think even asking questions to people you meet at a wedding show, for example, when they’re looking around, just say, what tools are you using to plan your wedding? What websites are you using? Where are you looking for your vendors? Because getting that kind of ad hoc conversation, you will start to see patterns.
And that’s often quite a helpful way to do it as well, rather than just going right, well, I can only attribute this many bookings to this platform,.
Zoe
00:19:09.180 – 00:19:23.200
And it’s a nice icebreaker as well. You know, when you’re dealing with a couple in the very first little touch point, which of the apps have you got? What are you using?
You’re doing, like market research, but you’re also starting a conversation with them that feels excited and in tune with where they are.
Becca
00:19:23.430 – 00:20:06.370
I’d love your advice on something else that I speak about with vendors quite a lot, which is, you know, these directories, your directories, they can be great places and they’re getting better and better and better for couples. And you’re making it so easy for, you know, if I’m looking for a venue, I can see all these great venues very quickly.
I can contact them all very quickly. And then what we see happen is that couples get a bit click happy, and they’re like, oh, here’s 25 different venues.
And they go, request more information, request more information. And then what happens is they get all the information back, they get bombarded and everyone gets ghosted.
Is there anything that we can do on the other side of that, knowing that they may be being bombarded to try and increase our conversion so we don’t just get lost in the mix of a million messages?
Zoe
00:20:06.690 – 00:21:15.880
I think you need to be really clear with what you’re offering. So having pricing information front and center is a big thing, because a lot of these couples don’t know what you’re doing.
As you say, they click happy, they’re throwing it out there, their budget’s 8k, they’re inquiring with venues that start 50k because they haven’t made that connection. Whereas if you can make it really clear, like your price is your biggest qualifier, right? Have that information front and center.
It doesn’t have to be super specific. But even if it’s just from 50k, that is a good way of weeding out people who are never, ever going to convert.
The other thing I’d say is it is something we’re really aware of here at Bright Book, and it’s something that we’re trying to figure out the best way around.
And one of the things that we are doing, as I mentioned earlier, is streamlining how many people we have listed in our directories as well now, and not having all those free listings that kind of clutter up, that get, like loads of leads that people have just fired out because they’re excited. We’re trying to make it so couples have a select number to browse and that it’s really high quality stuff as well.
Because I think the onus is on us as well. We’ve created that problem, we need to fix it.
Becca
00:21:15.880 – 00:21:50.460
And I guess it’s that thing as well around the educating of the couples, educating people going, you know what, in the first instance, just pick three and then, you know, pick another three because otherwise you will be overwhelmed. And I’m seeing it a lot out there in the industry that there’s such a stretch for perfectionism at the moment.
And so people are then having indecision.
So whereas someone would go on a venue tour and say, oh, I’ve been to two other venues, they’re saying things like, well, We’ve been to 15 venues so far because we’re so worried we won’t find the one. And what ends up happening is they just, they can’t pick because they’re so worried about getting it wrong and there’s.
Zoe
00:21:50.460 – 00:22:51.370
Just too many and you just don’t remember what you’ve seen. At that point, everything blurs into one venue. Yeah. It is about educating couples.
A lot of that is making sure that they kind of scale back and think realistically and rationally as well.
I think there is a bit of that social media myth of having the absolute perfect wedding and people put so much pressure on themselves to get that when actually it doesn’t exist. You know, your wedding will be wonderful, it will be amazing, it’ll be the best day of your life. But it will not necessarily be perfect. Yeah.
And you wouldn’t, you wouldn’t do it like if you were trying to buy something on Etsy, you wouldn’t bombard 50 people.
Because I think it’s that connect of like it’s a small business and people seem to realize it outside of weddings, but within the wedding industry, people don’t see it like that.
And that’s something I’ve been working on a lot in the last few years to try and make people realize it is actually just a lot of small independent businesses and you have to be respectful of them the way you are outside of this.
Becca
00:22:51.370 – 00:23:03.090
We need like a little pop up so that when they click too many businesses it pops up on private and says, are you sure you want to contact this many people? People calm down, it’s going to overwhelm you. Maybe pick a few less, do a bit more research.
Zoe
00:23:03.410 – 00:23:07.570
I will, I will send it to the dev team as a suggestion because.
Becca
00:23:07.570 – 00:23:09.170
Yeah, it would work better.
Zoe
00:23:09.490 – 00:23:13.490
Time out. Like, yeah, you’ve exceeded your request limit.
Becca
00:23:13.490 – 00:23:22.610
Please wait, just calm down because otherwise your inbox is going to be so full and you’re going to regret your life choices. So please just do some more research before you click this button.
Zoe
00:23:22.850 – 00:23:34.890
We’ve been there on a few sides of it where couples will then say, I never did this. And it’s like you did. You did.
You just don’t even remember because you sent out a hundred requests, so how can you possibly remember every single one?
Becca
00:23:34.890 – 00:23:50.570
Yeah, and then you Forget that all 100 of those businesses are going to send you five different reminders and now you’ve got 500 emails in your inbox. So, yes, we need to get out there and educate couples. Just less is more.
Do your research and narrow it down to three and then contact those three and then let’s go from there.
Zoe
00:23:50.730 – 00:23:51.850
Absolutely, yeah.
Becca
00:23:51.850 – 00:24:38.980
Now, talking about data, one of the things I have engaged with a lot over the last few years is, is your bride book report. Now, anyone listening to this podcast will know that I absolutely love an industry report. I love to pull out the stats.
I love to see if it’s backing up what I’m teaching on stage and on this podcast and to see what is going on out there. And your 2026 report is out now, so I’ve been having a little deep dive into it.
I’ve been looking at some of the different things and I wanted to chat to you about some of the things that you’re seeing in there, some of the things that I’m seeing in there to. To see what’s going on. I think these industry reports are helpful to reflect back to us as an industry, what people want.
Now, the first thing I saw in there that I thought was really interesting and definitely backs up what I’m teaching is around the length of time someone is getting engaged is dropping.
Zoe
00:24:39.380 – 00:25:34.220
Yes, yes, we are seeing this. And I think it’s really interesting because it’s something I’d been hearing kind of anecdotally as well. Obviously.
I joined Bright Book three weeks ago, so I wasn’t working on the team that compiled this data. But I have had a big look into it and I’ve been hearing that couples are keen, once they get engaged, they don’t want to wait around anymore.
And I think there’s a couple of reasons here. You know, people are getting engaged at an older and older age, so they’re, you know, more established in their life.
They don’t need perhaps such a long lead up to save, save up for things. I’m also seeing people have a bit more of a casual approach to it and perhaps they couldn’t even tell you the point.
They actually got engaged, but they decided to get married. And I’m hearing from a lot of vendors, a lot of venues that people are inquiring at a more kind of last minute rate than they did before. Before.
We’re getting much shorter lead times. Yeah. And I think that is because people are a bit more chill about it than they used to be.
Becca
00:25:34.300 – 00:25:53.340
I do think it’s a bit of the pandemic effect. I hate talking about it. I know it was so long ago, but I do think it did change. It changed our culture around planning things so far ahead.
Because when people have planned so far ahead, the world changed and everything got canceled. I know even in my own life, like, I don’t want to book holidays as far ahead as I used to in case something happens and I can’t go.
Zoe
00:25:53.420 – 00:26:06.600
Yeah. I mean, I think the wedding industry is one of the most, like, had the most lasting impact from COVID We’re still seeing it today, I think. Yeah.
Most places have moved on, but we’re still getting ripples here in the wedding world.
Becca
00:26:06.600 – 00:26:24.930
Yeah, we definitely are.
But I thought that was interesting that your stats backed up because I’ve been saying to people for a long time we’re seeing this shrinking in lead time and that is stressful for vendors because they’re used to the old way of doing things where their whole diary was booked up 12 months in advance and now they’re having to go into a year with gambling gaps and not panic.
Zoe
00:26:25.170 – 00:26:39.649
Because actually we know, and I’ve said it to so many people, is there are so many people in this boat.
And I know that doesn’t, you know, it doesn’t help with the gaps, but knowing that actually across the board everyone is experiencing the same thing, hopefully is reassuring.
Becca
00:26:39.970 – 00:27:21.310
Yeah. And actually the data backs up that it’s not that they don’t like you and they’ve disappeared, it’s just that they’re spending less time planning.
And actually that’s good for you and your budgeting and everything else when you get your head around it, because actually the work and the money will come into your business sooner. So the other thing that came out of the report quite strongly, I felt, Was this stat.
81% Of couples said they felt frustrated at the start of their journey. Now, this was particularly around when contacting a venue, although I imagine it probably translates across the rest of the industry as well.
And I Thought that was a really high stat, that that many people felt frustrated straight away when they were contacting someone. So what do you think that’s all about?
Zoe
00:27:21.310 – 00:28:33.700
I think there’s again two things to consider here, that people have incredibly high expectations.
When you get engaged, you’re so excited, you’re in that bubble and you are the only people in the world who have got engaged and who are planning a wedding. There is no one else and nor should there be anyone else. And so they’re inquiring and they’re expecting to be treated that way.
And we do have, again, we have businesses that are fatigued because they have had 100 inquiries a day from these couples who are the only people in the world to be getting engaged. So you know, they’re relying on automation, they’re relying on pre scheduled messaging and things.
And then people are suddenly like, well, excuse me, this is the biggest and best wedding you’re gonna have. And you’re not treating me like where’s my red carpet? That rolls out of your email.
And I think that is probably the biggest source of that is that they’re expecting this personalized touch. They’ve been told that this is going to be the most special, personalized, incredible experience of their life. And if they get an automated.
Thanks so much for your message. It’s in my inbox. I’ll get back to you.
I think it dulls the shine a little bit and it probably makes them feel a little bit more, not like overly negative towards it, but it does dull that excitement a little bit.
Becca
00:28:33.700 – 00:28:53.380
Yeah, I thought another interesting thing that it said in your report as well is they get frustrated when they download a brochure and get the same information in the brochure that they’ve already had. And I see this a lot and actually I see it being taught somewhere.
Some places that, oh, have a brochure to get the email addresses but then just have the same information in it. But it’s interesting that the couples are saying that’s annoying them.
Zoe
00:28:53.380 – 00:29:43.270
It is. Because, you know, it is actually a bit of an effort to download something, to go into your folder, to open it, to look through it.
If you’ve already seen the stuff like that is really annoying across the board. Like not just, but you know, you do it with restaurants and menus and things. If it’s, if it’s just the same stuff, like, what was the point?
Don’t give people extra admin for no reason. I think brochures should contain like detailed breakdowns of packages.
They should contain really like Beautiful imagery that you don’t already have on your website. They should go above and beyond, because if someone’s downloading a brochure, they are that bit more committed.
So you should be giving them a little bit more and maybe even you can include some sort of incentive for inquiring, like, anything you can do, because at that point they’re quite captivated. So, like, build on that. Don’t just treat them like another template to be fulfilled.
Becca
00:29:43.270 – 00:29:55.910
You need, like a little secret nugget in there somewhere that they get excited about. You remember back on, in the old days when you bought a CD and at the end of, like, track 10, if you left it going, there’s like a secret.
There was like a secret bit at the end that rewarded you for listening.
Zoe
00:29:56.070 – 00:30:21.770
Take the COVID out and unfold it. And it was a poster or something.
Yeah, just a little bit more for the, you know, go that little extra mile for that conversion, because I think it would be worth it. So you could have like a get, you know, buy three lots of canapes and get a fourth lot free or something.
If you inquire off the back of this brochure, like that kind of thing, just to make sure they’re reading it. Give them something extra and to show them that you, like, value them. Yeah.
Becca
00:30:21.770 – 00:30:59.470
And it is so difficult because at the moment we are seeing a lot of conflicting stuff going on.
And again, I have this conversation with people a lot where they’re like, well, on one hand you’re telling me to automate, and the other hand you’re telling me to personalize. And that is true. I am telling them both those things. And I do think, think we have to find a happy medium and find a way to do it.
So I’ve got some venues where we are now. They will get an automated message when they’re at the top of that excitement curve.
They need to get something that tells them what to do next, but then saying, follow it up as soon as you can with a second personal message as well, so that you know you’re seeing both sides of things, it’s not one or the other.
Zoe
00:30:59.550 – 00:32:03.330
Yeah. And even your automation can be tailored so your automated message could say, thanks for your message. Message, please reply.
Tell us the date you got engaged, tell us which platform you found us on, tell us these things and we will get back to you as soon as possible. Because then also you’re kind of qualifying as well.
Because if people don’t reply to that stage, then you can probably assume they’re not, again, as actively invested. As those who are doing it and downloading the brochure, get more information about them. That helps you tailor your messaging from then on.
And I think that’s really important because so I sent out that email the other day to people saying, hey, here I am. I think I had over 600 out, like out of office replies that all said, hey, your message is in my inbox. Thanks so much.
Or it’s some of, you know, variations on congratulations on your engagement. And I was thinking, I’m not engaged, like, but everybody’s telling me my emails in the inbox.
I know my email’s in your inbox because I put it in there. Like, I think we just need to, if we are doing automation, make it a little less the same as what everybody else is doing.
Becca
00:32:03.330 – 00:32:25.210
Yeah, add some personality into the automation and give people a clear next step. I think it’s particularly for venues.
Another stat that really stood out to me was the percentage of people that actually the next step they wanted to take straight away was to arrange a viewing. And so you talked about your inbuilt tools. I talked to people about having calendars like that first email back if that’s what they want to do next.
Make sure you include something so they can straightaway book at all.
Zoe
00:32:25.450 – 00:32:42.210
Even if they haven’t said they want to do that. Do it, keep them moving, like, give them something to do all the time. And yeah, I was really excited about the Bride Book Showround tool.
It launched last year. People can now literally book straight on through your. Through your listing, which is again trying to help accelerate those conversions.
Becca
00:32:42.210 – 00:32:49.170
And does that link into someone’s Google Calendar without getting too techy so that it can check their availability? Or do you put your own availability into it?
Zoe
00:32:49.250 – 00:33:08.040
I believe you can add your own availability in, but I will say that I’m still only three weeks in, so I’m still learning the process. I’ve seen that we’ve got the tool. I’ve seen that you can use it.
I’ve seen the calendar bit at the back end, but I think you can sort of set the areas where you can’t have show rounds or whatever. So you can kind of determine your availability through that.
Becca
00:33:08.040 – 00:33:18.840
Amazing. Well, if people are on broad book, go and investigate that further if that’s something you want to understand more about.
Or maybe I’ll go and investigate it further and then I’ll be able to tell you the. The technical stuff because I think I.
Zoe
00:33:18.840 – 00:33:20.200
Too will investigate it.
Becca
00:33:20.680 – 00:33:43.060
I think the thing is with all of this stuff and I get this, you probably get this as well, Zoe. When you meet with people one to one, everyone else has a slightly different version of the same chann challenge.
And so finding a way that makes this tool work for everyone is almost impossible. So, yeah, trying to understand how you can best get these things to work for you.
But if you’re already paying to be a Bride Book customer, make the most of these tools. Go and have the conversations, find out.
Zoe
00:33:43.060 – 00:34:15.930
Also thing, you know, Bride Book is very open to development and to change.
And that’s one of the reasons I came to work here, because they are still a small, privately owned business and they are able to kind of do things on their own agenda. So just last week I said, have we ever thought about this? And someone in the dev team was like, oh, let’s do it. And I was like, oh, wow. Okay.
So, you know, if you did say, I’ve used your showrun tool and actually I think you should be able to add an additional day of the week that doesn’t yet exist because that would make my life easier. We can look into it. I can’t say we could do it, but we could definitely look into it.
Becca
00:34:15.930 – 00:34:17.570
Yeah, that’s really good to hear.
Zoe
00:34:17.730 – 00:34:18.170
Okay.
Becca
00:34:18.170 – 00:34:45.600
Another interesting thing that came out of your report, which I love it when things in a report back up what I’ve been teaching for a year. And one of the things I’ve been teaching about in this age of the marketing theme park is the importance of word of mouth.
And actually when I looked at some of your data around how people first found again, particularly their venues, it said something like 40% of people found them offline, which is essentially word of mouth. And that is huge. That was the biggest stat. Did that surprise you?
Zoe
00:34:45.600 – 00:35:21.829
It did.
Because typically, like, you know, once upon a time, you couldn’t really rely on word of mouth because if you said, I got married here and I really liked it, someone would say, well, I can’t get married there because you got married there.
But I think that just goes to show how much people believe in, like, the personalization that they can do and realizing that actually no one’s going to judge you for getting married where your cousin got married.
Actually, it’s nice to go back and relive it and celebrate and you can make it into a totally different space suitable for a totally different style of wedding because venues offer so much versatility and flexibility now.
Becca
00:35:21.829 – 00:35:57.670
Yeah, I thought that was really interesting.
And I think what I’ve been saying, and obviously this, the stats back it up, is that in a world where we’re struggling to trust what’s true and what’s not true, suddenly word of mouth pays a big part. So people are scared about AI. People are scared about, you know, everyone being overwhelmed of all these different choices.
And so it stands out if your friend says you have to go here, or a family friend says, have you looked at that venue?
Or you’ve seen it in actual real life and you know that it’s good, that trust marker goes up, up, but yet all of the other parts also play a part in that because they will then go and look at all the other places to check you out.
Zoe
00:35:58.230 – 00:36:42.510
Yeah. And it’s. I mean, you say about trust.
I’ve also seen so many listings lately where on different websites where the images are all AI generated and it’s really obvious. And I just think, don’t do that. Please don’t do that.
Because you’re gonna end up in a tricky situation with your customers when you can’t deliver a rose that’s got three centers because AI generated it falsely, it’s been advertised as one of your creations. And also, it’s just it. You’re just, you’re not serving yourself. You’re adding to that mistrust that’s building.
And like you go on Pinterest now, everything is AI and it’s horrible. And we’re a creative industry and we should not be resorting to tools like AI to create our imagery.
Becca
00:36:42.670 – 00:37:10.370
Yeah, absolutely. But that is why the word of mouth works so well. Business to business, business to customer.
And we all need to be making sure we’re going to industry events, being in rooms, talking to people in actual real life, because that clearly matters to people in 2026. So we’ve talked a lot about the report. If people want to find the report for themselves, I’ll put the link in the show notes.
Is it free for people to download? Do they have to be a bride book customer to download it? Can anyone get their hands on it?
Zoe
00:37:10.370 – 00:37:31.370
Yes, you can. So if you search bride book, Wedding industry report, you will see on Google the link to download it.
And I think you just need to enter your email address, but it is free to download. And we also have an article on the average cost of a wedding as well, if you’re interested in that specific data set.
And again, just search average cost of wedding bride book and you will find that amazing.
Becca
00:37:31.370 – 00:37:43.910
I will put the links in the show notes for people. But I do recommend go and download that industry report. There is so much in there that we haven’t even touched on that we could talk about for hours.
And and like I said, I love it. It’s a great report. So thank you for continuing to do it.
Zoe
00:37:43.910 – 00:37:59.110
Brian. It’s like 160 something pages, isn’t it? Of just pure data. Yeah. And I’m very excited to actually be working on the one for next year.
We’re starting work on it now so we’ll have a little bit more of like me and my take on things in it, which I’m looking forward to.
Becca
00:37:59.110 – 00:38:03.950
Amazing. Well, all the marketing stats, they’re my favorite things. So get as many of those in there as possible.
Zoe
00:38:04.350 – 00:38:05.070
I will.
Becca
00:38:05.310 – 00:38:18.090
Incredible.
So as we look forward to 2026 then, what other things do you think are important label we haven’t touched on yet for people listening, businesses listening to be thinking about this year.
Zoe
00:38:18.250 – 00:39:18.000
Gosh, big question. I think we have kind of touched on it.
I think it is going back to that personal connection I think everybody is getting worried about like how do we optimize for AI? How do we make sure we appear in all these kinds of things?
Actually I think if we just do really good clean best practice marketing across the board and build work on building relationships with couples, that’s the most important thing. I think I see a lot of businesses get worked up because you know, oh my goodness, my content’s not going viral. This business went viral.
But I always say to people, what, what does that mean? Like how many people realistically can you serve in a year? And if your content is reaching that kind of number, you’re doing a good job.
Like if you reach 5 million people, you’re never going to be able to convert 5 million people. So don’t go after the bigger numbers all the time.
Don’t go after things that feel unattainable because, because you’re actually much better on drilling into what you specialize in and focusing on connecting with the people who are likely to convert and be interested in that.
Becca
00:39:18.080 – 00:39:43.200
Yeah, so true.
And to minimize the amount of marketing you’re doing, focus in on the three areas that you think are going to work best for you this year and go hard on them rather than doing a little bit of everything. And that’s where we see that problem with directories is where people try and do a little bit of everything.
They don’t spend the time on the, on that directory, they don’t update the listing, they don’t do any of the things that, that they need to do to make it work. And the same on social media and the same on their website. And actually we End up being busy fools.
Zoe
00:39:43.200 – 00:40:02.160
Yeah. And you can, you can only do so much, you know.
So if you don’t have the capacity, if you don’t have the team and the bandwidth to manage five different directory listings, don’t think it’s better to be everywhere than just a few places. Because it’s not. Because if you can’t serve those audiences, then it’s going to come back to bite you in the long run.
Becca
00:40:02.320 – 00:40:27.260
So true. Zoe, this has been such a fascinating conversation.
It’s really interesting to hear more about what, what’s going on at Bride Book right now, to know that you’re now a new face of it, that people can approach and chat to you and bring their feedback, which I think is a great thing for our industry as a whole, to make it more open and transparent. I always end my podcast with the same question. So I’m going to pose that to you now. And it’s this.
What’s one thing you personally wish you’d known sooner in business?
Zoe
00:40:27.660 – 00:41:03.780
Oh, gosh, I think the one thing I wish I had known is what I just kind of touched on, that bigger isn’t always better. I would always think, you know, we’ve got to get a million users, we’ve got to do this, we’ve got to do that.
There’s actually, what, 230,000 weddings in the UK each year.
If I reach 230,000 users, I feel like I’ve done my job well and that, you know, I don’t need to strive for four times that because they’re not getting married. I would rather chase the high quality traffic, conversions, couples, whatever you want to call them, then go really, really big.
But dilute my messaging.
Becca
00:41:03.780 – 00:41:28.460
That’s so true and also really important for people listening to pay attention to. Because it’s the same with what you’re doing with your social media, with everything else.
You don’t need to reach 5,000 people with a reel on Instagram.
It would be much better to reach 50 or 100 people who are the right people in your location, who want what you can offer and or are actually engaged, rather than 5,000 people that all live in Australia who aren’t even getting married because it’s a pointless stat.
Zoe
00:41:28.860 – 00:41:31.100
Over quantity every single time.
Becca
00:41:31.100 – 00:41:39.080
Absolutely. So people want to find out more about Bride Book, about you.
If they want to give their feedback, where are the best places for them to hang out and find you?
Zoe
00:41:39.080 – 00:42:05.590
So to find anything About Bright Book, brightbut.com It’s all there for me. I am on Instagram at Zoe Burke that’s B u r K E Underscore editor.
I’m on TikTok as wedding underscore editor or you can email me at zoe.burkeridebook.com those are probably the channels I’m like most active on. You can find me on LinkedIn as well. But I’m not sure sure if loads of wedding pros use that. So if social media is easier, that’s, that’s where I am.
Becca
00:42:05.590 – 00:42:14.590
Fantastic. Again, I will put all of the links for you in the show notes. I’ll put the link for the industry report as well. Anna, it’s been a great conversation.
Thank you so much for being here.
Zoe
00:42:14.590 – 00:42:16.870
It’s been amazing. Lovely start to the week. Thank you.
Becca
00:42:16.950 – 00:42:40.540
Such a great conversation with Zoe.
I think it’s really important that these big businesses come to places like this podcast and show the face behind the brand so that we can all understand what they stand for, who they are and how they can help us. So I’m thankful that Zoe came on the podcast today. Hopefully it’s answered many of your questions around directories and bride book in general.
But if you’ve got more she’s given you her details, reach out to her and I’ll see you all next time.
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