Show notes:
How to prevent wedding business burnout. Today I’m chatting with Wedding Photographer turned Zentangler – Becky Harley. Having hit burn out herself, Becky wanted to evaluate her time and work out how to look after herself amidst the chaos of life. Today we talk about Burnout, Balance and Business.
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Time Stamps:
00:10 – Managing Pressure Points in Wedding Planning
00:45 – Introduction to Burnout and Balance in Business
12:55 – Recognizing Burnout: Personal Experiences and Signs
17:43 – Finding Space for Self-Care and Mindfulness
34:09 – The Influence of Zentangling
Transcript:
Becky
00:00:00.160 – 00:00:20.160
Seeing where the pressure points are going to be is really important because if you can try and manage that in advance, because the thing is with weddings, you end up taking so many bookings quite far in advance, don’t you? So you can kind of see where those pressure points are going to be.
And if you know it’s going to be a really busy time, try and factor in some plans to help you manage that burnout.
Becca
00:00:21.200 – 00:01:14.270
I’m Becca Poutney, wedding business marketing expert, speaker and blogger, and you’re listening to the Wedding Pros who Are Ready to Grow podcast. I’m here to share with you actionable tips, strategies and real life examples to help you take your wedding business to the next level.
If you are an ambitious wedding business owner that wants to take your passion and use it to build a profitable, sustainable business doing what you love, then you’re in the right place. Let’s get going with today’s episode. Today I’m chatting to my good friend Becky Harley.
I’ve known and worked with Becky since I started my own business back in 2016. She is very well known for photography in both branding and weddings.
But in recent years, Becky has started a new business focusing on something completely different. Today she’s going to be talking about burnout balance and how she switches off rest and relaxation is something we all need to pay more attention to.
So I’m really looking forward to finding out more. Becky, welcome to the podcast.
Becky
00:01:14.430 – 00:01:16.030
Hello, Becca, how are you?
Becca
00:01:16.670 – 00:01:21.710
I’m very well, really. I should say welcome back to the podcast because you were on one of my very first episodes.
Becky
00:01:21.790 – 00:01:24.350
I was back ages ago. It must be now.
Becca
00:01:24.430 – 00:01:51.170
Yeah, we’re now on like nearly at 200 episodes.
So yeah, it was a little bit of a time ago, but it’s great to have you back and I’m really looking forward to talking about something a bit different today, but something that as small business owners, we really need to be paying attention to now.
Before we get into that though, I want to get people to know a bit about you because if they haven’t listened to that first episode or they don’t know you, just give, you give everyone a little potted history of you, your background and how you’ve got to this point.
Becky
00:01:51.170 – 00:07:23.790
Thank you, Dave. Well, in a nutshell. So I’m Becky, I am.
I live in Hertford in Hertfordshire and I started my business, my first business, I started back in kind of 2015, so 10 years ago now, which is mad. And I previously was working in London. I worked for charities and I was doing event Planning.
I was doing new business idea generation and setting up new projects and things and it was all like really cool and really fun and I. But I kind of fallen into it after university and knew that I kind of wanted to try something for me.
So after I got married in 2014, I set up a wedding photography business and really threw myself into it and managed to go full time in that business in 2016. So around the time that we met and yeah, and I guess it went from strength to strength. I was, I built it up. I was really proud of.
I kind of managed to grow it really quickly, went full time quite quickly and I was, it was really successful. I was, you know, doing really well. I was really doing lots of really awesome weddings and it was just all going really well.
I did that so for a few years and I then had babies which was part of the reason I wanted to, to go kind of self employed, I guess. So to have that flexibility to be able to, to run a business and make money while still having children, spending time with my family.
And so obviously then, you know, things were pretty crazy when I was, you know, doing the whole maternity leave and babies thing and I was really like, at times I really struggled with my, with my mental health and balancing everything and being able to show up and work and you know, I went back to do my first wedding off when my daughter, my first child was only like 2 months old. Like it was kind of crazy at times.
And I kind of look back now and think, wow, I can’t believe I, I kind of pushed ahead and went and did and just I almost carried on as if I hadn’t had a baby, which is a bit mad but you know, I was trying to run a business in the same way despite also having two small children. And then obviously happened as well and we all know how crazy that time was.
So I continued, yeah, running my business and kind of adapting slightly so I was doing more stuff in the week with, when, you know, weddings were a bit quieter with the, with branding and everything as you know.
And yeah, I think as my children got older I found that I wanted to do something that’s a little bit more kind of, that was less weekend based, I guess because my obviously wedding business was very weekend heavy. And then I also had a kind of a. Quite a big event in my life that happened in 2023 when my mum passed away quite suddenly and she was.
It was all kind of quite unexpected and I kind of had to work on all of the admin that comes with, with that When. Which is difficult enough when you’re in a. You know, when you’re going through a grieving process, I guess. But when.
After my mum passed away, I kind of discovered this thing that she was. Had been doing a lot and she talked to me about it a lot, which is called Zentangle, which is this, like, mindful draw.
And so I kind of looked into that a little bit more and kind of tried it out a bit more.
I’ve always been quite arty and creative, I guess, which took me to the kind of wedding photography element, an aspect of kind of running my business. You have to have creative bones in your body if you’re gonna do that for. For your. For your business. And yeah, I’d kind of.
My mom had introduced me to it when. When in Covid, actually.
And it was a really nice way of kind of switching off and kind of getting a bit of kind of creative time, but without too much pressure or, you know, it was just kind of nice and quiet and you could sit down and do this really nice drawing meditation almost in a really busy time. But I had obviously a newborn or I was about to have a newborn when I first did it and it was all a bit too much, really too much else going on.
But yeah, revisited it once my mum had passed away and found all of her, you know, her kit and things for it. She was a certified teacher of this, of the Zentangle method.
And yeah, basically just kind of rediscovered it from there and ended up becoming a certified teacher of this drawing method myself.
And then decided, because, you know, that’s what I do, I set up a business to teach other people because I found it really, really helpful, especially when I was in those kind of moments of coming back into weddings after Covid.
Obviously we know that Covid shut everything down for a couple of years, but then after that there was a whole load of kind of trying to fit all of the postponed weddings into that crazy time when, you know, people were booking things again. But there was still these weddings that had been postponed that you were trying to fit into the. Into the mix.
And I was also then on maternity leave with two small children, so it was a really crazy time. But this was something that I found in that time when I was feeling really burnt out and it was all too much.
I found that this was a really helpful tool to kind of switch my brain off a little bit and take.
Come away from that hectic element of, you know, the crazy wedding season and alongside having a family, alongside all these postponements that were happening or, you know, the postponements that were happening after having been postponed, I suppose. And, yeah, this kind of quiet time that I could spend where my.
My brain was not thinking about all the other plates I was trying to spin, really, I found it was really, really helpful to me. And so, yeah, when I started doing a business, I felt like I could help other people with it, too.
Becca
00:07:23.790 – 00:08:36.100
One of the privileges for me, especially when I work with people for a long time, is that I get to see people walking through all these different aspects of life.
And we talked about the fact that we’ve known each over a decade now, which is absolutely crazy to say, but I’ve seen that journey for you and I’ve seen it for so many other people, and I don’t think we talk about it enough where we have these massive life changes. And I think when you’re just seeing the Instagram surface of a business, it all just ticks along fine.
But actually, the reality behind it is very different for everyone.
And I’ve watched you be really successful as a photographer and absolutely own your craft, and then I’ve watched you have children and seen how that was difficult and.
And it’s difficult for all of us to suddenly shift how you run business and change your mindset and then see what happened with your mum and everything that you’ve been through there.
And, you know, I think it’s just important for us to stop and pause for a second because there will be people listening that are also walking through all of these things. And I think sometimes we just keep on piling them on top of each other.
And it sounds like that was what you did for quite a long time where you’re just like. And I just can add another thing and then just another thing and then just another thing, but eventually it’s. It’s just too much.
So is there a point that you can remember in that journey where you thought, I’ve burnt out. This has got too much, 100%.
Becky
00:08:36.420 – 00:12:45.870
I think the first point before kind of even we added Covid into the mix, was that when I was working in weddings with my daughter, and so for context, the daughter that I’m talking about is now seven. So this is quite a long time ago. It’s funny, actually, I was looking this morning through some.
Some of my previous weddings from 2017 and 2018, and I can remember thinking, oh, that’s the wedding that I did just after I found out I was pregnant. And it’s actually quite early on in my photography career, I guess it was in 2017.
And then she was born in, in early 2018, right at the beginning of wedding season. And as I said, I kind of just carried on as normal. Like I.
There were maybe a handful of weddings that I handed off to other photographers, but I still edited them all myself and went back when she was 2, 2 months old to go and shoot weddings. And I think some of that is like the naivety of, you know, not knowing what it’s going to be like when you have a baby. But I did.
In hindsight, I definitely think that I had, like, I just had too much pressure on myself. Like I was trying to deliver everything in the time that I said I was going to deliver it, whilst also navigating motherhood as a first time mom.
And I, looking back, I definitely think I had elements of postnatal depression. Like I was withdrawn from people, I was only thinking about work and I wasn’t sleeping well. Even when I was able to sleep.
My daughter was actually a really good sleeper. So it was, it was definitely definite elements of burnout at that time for sure.
And I think if I could go back to me, then I would definitely tell myself that I needed to switch off and like take a break because it, it’s a lot. And then again, like, I didn’t want to do that again.
When I had my second child and I, when I found out I was pregnant with him, it was early in the year and I remember thinking, well, well, I’ve had like maybe eight weddings booked in for 2021. So I was like, he’s gonna be born in November. He would. I didn’t know it was a he at the time, but he. My baby was born in November.
I could sort of see ahead that I didn’t want to have a year full of weddings in the same way that I did when my daughter was born. And so I thought, right, I’m going to start taking bookings for next year at this point.
And this was just before COVID hit maybe a few weeks beforehand.
And then obviously everything for that year that I had planned to do when I was pregnant ended up just not happening and then moving to the following year. So that I kind of, I tried to engineer it so that I knew I wasn’t going to be burnt out in that year.
But then I think I ended up having 30 weddings instead of 10, which was, yeah, not, not ideal. Although obviously then, you know, with COVID extending into 2021, it ended up being only half that.
So it was still more than I wanted to do, but it was, it was More stressful than I wanted it to be. But I think that, you know, the elements of kind of the.
The burnout, like, the symptoms of it, I think in hindsight are actually really, like, they’re really real. Like when you’re burnt out, you kind of. You find yourself more detached from things.
I think you find almost like you’re demotivated to kind of to do the work that you need. You’re working so hard to do.
It’s a weird kind of, kind of contradiction in a way, but there’s like physical elements of poor sleep and, you know, or insomnia.
And like, I just think when you have that kind of repeated and prolonged high demand on you, but you’ve only got a certain amount of resources to kind of deliver, you know, and when you’re your own business, there’s that pressure of being everything and wearing all the hats.
But then alongside that, obviously everyone’s got their own pressures of home life, you know, with family and with, you know, perhaps even people are working with two jobs and having their. Their wedding business as a side hustle. And I think you just need to make sure that you’re aware of what’s going on in your brain.
And also planning ahead, like, knowing that having.
Seeing where the pressure points are going to be is really important because if you can try and manage that in advance, because the thing is with weddings, you end up taking so many bookings quite far in advance, don’t you? So you can kind of see where those pressure points are going to be.
And if you know it’s going to be a really busy time, try and like, factor in some plans to help you manage that burnout that you know is potential potentially going to come.
Becca
00:12:46.030 – 00:14:00.080
Often we end up in this kind of spiral as well.
And I think you’ve probably seen that a little bit too, where we know that we need to take the pressure off because we’ve got too many things going on.
But we also know if we take the pressure off, it might mean that income comes down and then we have that financial pressure of we’re not bringing in so much income because we’re not working so much. And then we then start piling it all back on and we kind of go round and round in these circles.
And I think the other thing, particularly as a parent that I found is you also just become lower and lower in the pecking order because your own health and your own everything becomes lower than everything else because you’re thinking about your clients and delivering for them and making sure they’re happy and then you’re thinking about your children, making sure they’re happy and maybe a partner if you’ve got one of those, and making sure they’re happy. And you’re so low down the list that I think that’s why we ignore these signs for so long now.
I think the signs of burnout can be different for everyone. So I think it’s helpful for us to talk about our own experiences and how we see it in ourselves. And I think it’s a bit of a buzzword.
People say, oh, you can get burnt out. And I do think there’s like long term burnout. And I think there’s also.
I see short term burnout and I’ve got better over time of noticing my own signals of burnout. So I’d love to know from your perspective, what is it that shows you you’re hitting that point. And then I’ll share some of mine.
Becky
00:14:00.080 – 00:15:49.900
I think what I. I think definitely one of the things for me is that I find myself procrastinating and I feel like that’s a really kind of. It’s.
It’s a bit of an oxymoron, isn’t it? Like you’re really, really busy and you end up doing stuff that’s not useful. But for me, procrastination is quite a big one.
Like, if I know that I’ve got loads and loads on my plate, I actually find it really hard sometimes to sit and get stuff done, which seems mad. But for me, procrastination, if I’m starting to procrastinate on things, I think I need.
Think I need some time to like, reset and just like reevaluate, you know, the priorities here. That’s one for me. And I also find, like, for me, sleep is a massive one.
Like when my kids were little, obviously it was harder to identify because I wasn’t really sleeping anyway, because my kids, especially my, my second child, was not a good sleeper. But I’ve definitely found personally, like, when there’s a lot of stuff going on, like last year, for example, I had lots of weddings happening.
I was running this, this new venture that I was trying to build up, but we were also moving house. There were still elements of sorting out my mum’s estate that was happening and, and I. My sleep was really bad.
Like, if I ever woke up in the night, I would find it really, really hard to get back to sleep again. And that, again, it’s just part of like a vicious circle, isn’t it? Because you’re tired, then when you Sit down to work.
And I would find myself, especially in the afternoons, just being like, oh my gosh, I cannot keep my eyes open. Sat at my desk. And so my sleep was like having that sleep. Hygiene was a real problem.
I think when it comes to burn, having so many plates you’re trying to spin and having so many things on your brain. So definitely for me those two were big kind of key things.
I think that helped me kind of realize that I was not acting in a way that was going to be beneficial to myself or my business. I think that was definitely key for burnout for me.
Becca
00:15:49.980 – 00:17:43.490
Yeah, for me I think there’s some similarities. I really resonate with the thing about procrastinating and not doing what you need to do. I, I’ve written down on my notes, numbness.
When I feel burnt out and overwhelmed, I almost become numb and just don’t do anything. Almost like punishing myself. It’s like I’m so busy and yet I’m doing nothing.
And so then I’m then like going through this cycle of, well, now I haven’t done anything, so now I’m busier. So numbness and like kind of just procrastinating is definitely one for me. The other things I’ve.
I’ve put down here is I think I notice that I’m more short tempered around my family if I’m burnt out or overwhelmed or stressed with work. And so I find myself snapping at the kids.
And then again that builds the guilt because then you know that you’re doing that and then you feel guilty about that and again the pressures build up. And the third one I’ve written down is I find when I’m, when I’m really hitting a point of being burnt out or overwhelmed is not being present.
So I’m present physically, but my head is all over the place. And so I can notice that the kids are talking to me and I’m not even on my phone, but my head is just going around, around.
And I realize I’m not actually listening or hearing what they’re saying to me because there’s just too many thoughts going around my head. And so I think those for me are the big signs. Not being present and also kind of falling out of love with the business.
I hear that a lot from wedding business owners. It’s like they’ve got this successful business and they’ve got so burnt out that they’ve kind of lost the passion for it, lost the love of it.
And I always know when I start thinking I don’t like this anymore. I need a job at Tesco’s. That’s a sign to me that. No, no, Becca, what are you talking about? You do like this. It’s just you, you’re just overwhelmed.
You need to take a break. But as business owners, we find it really hard to take a break because of all of the things I’ve just said.
We’re so busy, we’ve got a whole long to do list. It’s really hard for us to take time out. So how have you started to fit this in?
How do we find space for this self care, for this mindfulness, for this reset even though we’ve got these massive to do lists?
Becky
00:17:43.490 – 00:20:02.370
You know what I think when you think about it like, oh, I need to find time for that as well. It can come become just another thing that’s on your to do list that is easy to procrastinate on.
And I think sometimes people feel like with taking time for self care or it needs to be, I need to set aside time to do that as well now. Like, oh, when am I going to find time in my busy schedule to go to a spa day? Like I haven’t got time to take a day off and go to the spa.
Like it’s more.
But you know, I think self care and mindfulness are kind of terms that are thrown about a lot and they can feel a little bit, you know, alien to us sometimes. Or maybe even a little bit like woo, woo. Like, oh yeah, okay. Like I’ll sit and just think.
Well, I’ve been a my mindfulness, I’ll just sit, sit at my desk and, and meditate and that can feel really difficult to do. Like, you know, I certainly, I’ve tried to do meditation before and I end up just thinking, oh, what’s on my shopping list?
Did I need to, did I send that email that I needed to send yesterday? Or oh God, what time have I got to go pick the kids up?
You know, like all of these, you sit and try and do something mindful and actually it’s, it’s your brain ends up whack where it was before because you’ve got too many things that you’re thinking about doing. I think one of the things that I’ve discovered from doing this, this mindful drawing is that it’s keeping your brain active still.
It’s not like you’re, you know, having to tell yourself off because your brain’s wandered off and you’re like not thinking about thinking. Do you know what I mean? It’s like when you are doing something that is keeping yourself busy, even for 10 or 15 minutes.
And that’s all you need to be able to do this kind of thing. This kind of. I find that. That mindful drawing is really helpful because it’s key, it’s creative. And that’s kind of.
Obviously, I have a quite a creative brain anyway, but by keeping your hand busy but focused on your. From your brain focused on what you’re doing, it’s. It’s. Stop.
It’s keeping your brain from being busy and running around and thinking of all these different things you have to do, but even just taking 10 minutes to sit and do it, like a small bit of drawing, like one line at a time, repetitive line drawing really helps you take that step back and switch things. Switch off, but not switch off. If that means it’s kind of active meditation, it’s.
It’s doing something with your hands and your brain, but it’s taking it away from all of the busyness of your.
Becca
00:20:02.370 – 00:20:04.490
Life and doing something for yourself.
Becky
00:20:04.810 – 00:20:05.369
Exactly.
Becca
00:20:05.369 – 00:20:53.210
Because, again, like, what we were talking about earlier is we’re always putting everyone else first and doing everything for everyone else. And we.
I’d really like to encourage people listening to just take 30 seconds right now to reflect on the week you’ve had or the day you’ve had or the month you’ve had, and just think, when have I done anything just for myself where I’ve done something where I’m not thinking about all of the other things and I’m just in that moment thinking for myself. And I guess that can be different for everyone, Becky. And for some people it could be drawing. For some people, it could be other things.
I know for me, one of the things I do each week still is have my singing lesson. And people, including the teacher, often say to me, why are you doing this? Like, you’re not, like, practicing for a console or anything.
I’m like, I’m doing it because it’s my, like, 30 minutes of a week where I can just do something that’s. It’s exactly like that. It’s something I enjoy, but I’m not having to be active and think about anything else. I can just be present.
Becky
00:20:53.450 – 00:21:55.860
Exactly.
I think that’s, for me, like, one of the things I also prioritize is getting to the gym because I find, and especially found, like, working out, like, at the gym or wherever was really, really helpful, especially straight after my mum passed away. Like, I found it really took my mind off of everything that was going on, like all of this stress.
So you know, moving your body in any kind of form I think is really, really helpful as well. For me, definitely. Like, like. And, you know, obviously, like, the mindful drawing thing that I’m doing is not for everyone.
Like, it’s not everyone’s cup of tea to do any kind of art necessarily, but there’s a huge amount of research around things like, well, working out as well. Like, and also art and craft or doing something like that that’s creative. I mean, your singing is creative.
Like that kind of all of those things, those things that in with working out, like all the endorphins that are released in your, in your brain, like really, it’s really beneficial to the, the body as a whole, but also kind of the creative aspect. And there’s loads of research around how creativity is hugely beneficial for mental health.
Becca
00:21:55.940 – 00:22:13.260
We don’t do enough of it. Even as children now, we don’t do enough of it.
You know, where people used to sit and draw and color and all that things, now they’re just on an iPad all the time. Actually, we’re the same. We. We don’t sit and draw and color or do creative things because we’re just on our phones all the time.
And they’re the absolute thief of any kind of mindfulness, in my opinion.
Becky
00:22:13.570 – 00:22:30.850
I think so, yeah. I think it’s interesting you mentioned drawing and coloring because I think adult coloring was like quite a thing, wasn’t it?
For a while that was quite popular.
And this is the thing that I’m doing is kind of similar to that, except you’re kind of creating the patterns to color, but you don’t have to color them. But yeah, it’s. It’s definitely kind of similar in, in that vein.
Becca
00:22:30.850 – 00:22:48.110
So how do you now find time for this? Going back to the time element, I assume that your own mindfulness, drawing, your own Zentangling, is something you’re now practicing yourself.
So is it something you do every day? Is it something you do when you feel like you’re bur out? Is it something you do for pleasure? Talk to me about that.
Becky
00:22:48.110 – 00:25:53.480
So I. I find just sometimes sitting down in front of the telly and keeping my hand busy, even doing it is quite nice to do.
Or I tend to, if I’m not watching the telly with it, I’ll put some music on and just sit for maybe half an hour. The nice thing about Zentangle that when I’m have been doing that is that the format is really small.
So you work on these very small tiles that are like three and a Half by three and a half inches square tiles. And so it’s. The format is small so you can kind of start something and finish something quite quickly.
It’s not like you’re creating a huge piece of artwork or for example, like in the past I’ve or still do like enjoy things like knitting and crochet to switch off in the evening. Now the thing with that is that I have probably three or four projects that have been going on for maybe five to 10 years.
I’ve got half a jumper that I’ve started knitting somewhere in my house. I enjoy cross stitch as well.
I’ve got a cross stitch project that I started 10 years ago, probably Christmas related one, and that is again still sort of languishing in the corner of my living room because sometimes I pick it up and put it down and it’s a really long project that is going to take a long time for me to complete.
Whereas one of the reasons that I’ve fallen in love with this particular kind of art form, I guess, is that you can sit down and complete a piece of Zentangle art In you know, 15 minutes, as little as 15 minutes, maybe kind of up to sort of half an hour, an hour.
But you’ve completed it and at the end of it you have that sense of completion and that kind of that nice boost of your self esteem you get when you finish a project, which is really nice obviously when, because I’m doing it for a job now, I end up doing it a lot during the day as well.
But it’s amazing how even when I’m doing it for my work, I’ve sat down and felt really stressed about like, you know, something that’s happened that day and be like, oh no, I can’t. I don’t have time to sit and do this now. I don’t have. I’m not in the right headspace to sit and record a video lesson.
But actually I sat down and recorded the video lesson because that was what I had to do, my to do list. And I felt so much better afterwards. Like the stress just left my body. It was.
It’s amazing how just that quiet focus of bringing your attention to something else, it just kind of takes away any of that kind of stressed feeling.
I think it’s the kind of, you know, the feel of the pen, the pen on the paper, or just the kind of watching something come together slowly but surely through one stroke at a time of your pen, it kind of evaporates any of the stress that you were feeling. It’s quite Magic, Really?
But yeah, I mean, I think even just five or ten minutes of doing that is, is kind of fires up the synapses of your, you know, the connections in your brain between your hand and your head.
Like, I think hand eye coordination is something that you kind of lose even when you’re so busy typing on your computer or you’re so busy kind of on your phone like replying to emails or whatever, or writing blogs. You know, you’re not, not holding a pen and paper so much anymore.
And I think that doing something like this is really beneficial for that kind of hand eye coordination, apart from anything.
But yeah, five minutes here and there is all you need really to be able to switch off and kind of reconnect with those elements that I think we sometimes lose in the modern day.
Becca
00:25:53.560 – 00:26:21.020
Yeah, absolutely.
And I like the reality of that because what you’re not telling us, which often people tell us, is get up at 4:30am every day and do your 30 minutes of drawing and then you’ll be ready for the day ahead. And that just doesn’t work for everyone actually.
It’s a bit more like, okay, let’s do something for ourselves, let’s find the something that helps us relax and then let’s enjoy doing it in those space in between. Otherwise it just becomes another thing, like you said on the to do list, and you’re putting more pressure on yourself to get up early and do it.
Becky
00:26:21.020 – 00:28:25.130
Exactly.
I think as well it’s a really, I find it’s a really nice thing to replace the doom scrolling with because I have, I would, you know, put the kids to bed and you’ve, you’ve only got a couple of hours to yourself before you need to go to bed yourself, before, you know, to try and get some decent rest.
And when I’m sat on the sofa of an evening, it’s very easy just to pick up my phone and look at Instagram or scroll through one of the other social media channels and just find myself like an hour later. What have I just done with that hour? What have I accomplished? Nothing at all.
I’ve just made myself feel worse from looking at the news or looking at, you know, other people having a great time and doing loads of really amazing things. Things. And actually this is a really nice way to kind of give yourself something to do that’s not just sat looking at your phone.
It’s kind of giving you all the benefits of having that kind of creative time and taking you away from that sometimes quite toxic online kind of scrolling situation, which I find is really, really difficult to get out of. Sometimes it’s just a habit. It’s kind of breaking the habit of doing that as well. And, you know, it doesn’t have to be along kind of.
There’s courses and stuff you can follow, like multiple lessons and things, but some of them only take, you know, 15 minutes here and there. I’ve got YouTube videos where you can follow patterns that only take 10 minutes. Like, it’s. There’s lots of options if you.
Depending on the amount of time you have. One other thing that I like to do is to take a pen and pencil and a tile, like a paper sort of paper or a sketchbook with me.
If I’m going somewhere like that, I know I’m be going to sat for a while.
So, you know, a doctor’s waiting room or, you know, if when my kids are at their swimming lessons, I’m sat in the car waiting for them to come out, I’ll take that rather than again sitting on my phone and just staring into the abyss of Instagram. It’s. It’s a nice way to kind of slot it into your day.
And the nice thing about it is that these tiles and things are really small and portable and like you just need a pen and a pencil. So it’s really easy to take around with you and pop in your pocket. Almost the same way as your phone.
Becca
00:28:25.130 – 00:28:58.570
Yeah, we need to find things to replace our phone. Now. There is one contradiction in your story, Becca, that we need to address because people may be thinking it, because I’m thinking it as well.
And I want to talk a little bit about it because we’ve talked about how you had all of these things going on and you hit burnout yourself and then you ended it with. So I started another business which could be seen as well, Tony. Becky, just. You’re just adding more to your plate rather than helping yourself.
So how has starting this actually helped you or how are you balancing what you’re doing now so that you’re not just adding something else and burning out even more?
Becky
00:28:58.570 – 00:30:38.650
That’s a really good question. One of the things obviously with weddings, as everyone knows, is that there’s a lot of.
There’s an on and off season, you know, so when I’ve have in PR in previous years, when I focused on kind of the weddings in the summer and doing all the editing and stuff, I’ve kind of picked up another project in the off season, as it were. So obviously there’s things that you can work on your business when you’re not Working in your business in the, in the winter or the off season.
But I’ve kind of set up, you know, the, the branding element of my business and this was just kind of another element of the business that I set up. Instead of focusing more on that, I did this in the off season.
So I did a lot of the recording and stuff in the off season and then then done kind of worked on the photography side of the business at the other, the other, the other end. And obviously, you know, everyone knows there’s a lot of kind of things now that have helped with automations and stuff.
And like for example, with AI editing with photography, that’s helped a lot.
So streamlining processes to give me more time in the week to do a little bit of this instead of, you know, I honestly, the time I used to spend like going through every single photo and adding my preset to every single photo myself, like the AI editing that I’ve used for, for photography has really hugely helped me save a lot of time and stress because it applies my preset and makes the basic changes that I would have made myself. You know, it’s, it does that for me and then I can go through and kind of make sure everything’s kind of aligned with my normal level of delivery.
So AI has really helped with that for sure.
Becca
00:30:38.650 – 00:31:13.810
I think as well, it’s important to just understand for all of us that it’s okay for us to evolve in our business journey as well.
And I again, I see this quite a lot when I’ve worked with people a long time is actually the business we wanted 10 years ago to the business we want now may be very different. I see it in my own life.
I’m always changing the goalposts and changing the things because depending on what’s going on around you, depends on what you actually want to say yes or no to.
And so for me, I see that you said earlier on that you don’t want to work so many weekends and so this is a route for you to be able to bring some of your work into the weekdays.
Becky
00:31:13.810 – 00:32:55.570
Definitely. I think that. I think personally for me, and this might not be the case for everyone, but for me weddings were, was a fantastic thing to work on.
Like when my children were younger, because I was with my children all day long in the week when they were small. And so going away and working at the weekends was actually quite nice, quite nice break.
But I think it’s, it’s true to say like that your business and your requirements for your business or what you need from Your business evolve over time. And now my children are both out of the house all day at school. I want to have my weekends the.
Where I can see them and spend time doing the things that, that was the, the, you know, it’s being able to leave work early and go and pick them up from school is still really beneficial to me and having that flexibility of being self employed. But that now extends to a different kind of element for me.
Like I want to have a bit more time at the weekends to spend with them because they’re always off, they’ve got such busy social lives, they’re always off. Like I need to take them here and there.
And so when if they going to a day full of birthday parties on a Sunday, I want my Saturday to be able to spend time with them and do stuff as a family.
And that’s the kind of advantage of being self employed I guess, is that you can pivot and you can tweak what you do in order to fit it around what works best for you. And I also think that the industry has changed slightly in that time, like from when I was doing weddings 10 years ago to now.
It’s very different, I would say.
And I don’t think there’s any harm in looking at what else can work for you in your business and what, what is working and what isn’t working for you in terms of fitting it in with your like what you want to do and what you want to.
Becca
00:32:55.650 – 00:34:21.010
Spend your time on, bringing it full circle.
The thing is, because I always encourage people, you know, even once a year, and I do this myself, sit back, reflect, look at where you’re at in the year, what do you want to achieve, where do you want to go, what do you want to change, what you want to say yes, no, to set those boundaries. But in order to have the headspace to do that, you can’t be at burnout because you can’t make those decisions.
When you’re at the edge of the abyss looking over, you need to be at a place, place where you, you’ve got the mind space to think about it. So you almost need to put in some self care to be able to then make those bigger long term decisions.
Because when you’re absolutely up against it, you can’t see a route forward.
It’s why I often find on holiday is when I have my next best idea because we’ve taken some time out, away from everything to just sit back and reflect.
So don’t make the rash decisions when you’re in the thick of it, you’ve got to kind of do that work work, find that space, get some head space in order to then look at where you want to move your business going forward. And I think that’s really important.
I just want to touch on, before we finish, on the influence that your mum has had on this, because I know that this entangling was her thing and it was almost a discovery that you made after she did sadly pass away. And I love that you’ve. You’ve kind of picked it up and run with that.
So talk to me about how that happened has influenced your decision and then just explain to us, for anyone who hasn’t quite worked out what this zentangling thing is yet, exactly what it looks like.
Becky
00:34:21.010 – 00:37:06.700
Of course. So. So my mum was a certified Zentangle teacher, which I knew was a thing, but I hadn’t really kind of given it a huge amount of thought.
She was retired, so she was just living her best life doing all the art and craft that she could possibly ever fit into her schedule. That was basically what her life was like every day. And then, yeah, when she. So she. The.
The week before she passed away, she’d booked for both of us to go a kind of craft retreat somewhere in the uk.
We were going to go to a hotel and learn to do Tunisian crochet together, which was kind of random, but it was kind of what we were both interested in, so we were going to go on and do that together.
But then obviously, sadly, we lost her and so I canceled that weekend because I didn’t feel like I wanted to go and learn Tunisian crochet by myself in a hotel. But I was looking at all of her Zentangle stuff and looking online at what it was and finding out more about it and.
And I found that there was a training seminar to learn to be a certified teacher. And it just so happened that it was the same weekend that we’d booked to do our weekend away together.
And it felt like, I mean, I’m not really one for believing in fate and woo woo, all that stuff, but it felt like it was the right thing.
It felt like there was something telling me that I had to do it at that time and I was again arming and arring about the cost of it because I’ve already got a business, I haven’t got time to go and learn how to do a whole new thing. But one of the. My mum’s pension payments come through came through that basically covered the exact cost of the seminars.
And I just felt like it was an opportunity not that I couldn’t pass up. So I spent that weekend, it was a remote thing, so I was just at home doing it.
But I really kind of got in depth into the, this Zentangle method and learned a lot more about it and then had my teaching qualification so I could share it with other people. And that was where my new business was born. My new business is called Ivy’s Corner, which is somewhat named after my mum.
Her, one of her middle names was Ivy. So I wanted to have a nod to her in the business and say that felt like a good name for the business.
So the Zentangle method, it was basically created by a couple in the states about 20 years ago. And one the lady is a kind of a renowned illustrator, an artist and her partner was, amongst many other things, a Buddhist monk at one time, time.
And basically she was drawing these patterns repetitive, one line at a time. And he realized that the sort of state that she was in while she was doing this was almost meditative.
And so they basically created this method to make it accessible for other people to achieve this kind of calm, focused state of mind. You know, when you’re in that state where you’re doing, you’re doing something and you are so focused that you kind of forget everything else.
Becca
00:37:06.700 – 00:37:39.600
Now you’ve told me that Zentangling is so simple because I’m not an arty, crafty person at all. My creativity is definitely the music side of things. But you’ve told anyone can do this, Absolutely anyone.
I think I’m going to take you up on that challenge to try and maybe even I’ll share the results. Although that is very brave of me because I am really bad at drawing. Now you have a free lesson.
So if anyone else is listening and they’re thinking, this sounds really interesting, I’m interested in what Becky’s doing now. I’m interested in how it’s helped her find these mindful moments in between running her wedding business.
How do people go about finding this lesson and what do they need to get started?
Becky
00:37:39.600 – 00:38:17.970
Well, first of all, you’re right, anyone can do it. Because the thing with Zentangle is that you’re not drawing a thing.
Like if I was to sit down and try and draw, draw like a bowl of fruit, then I would fail miserably because it wouldn’t look good. I would think it was rubbish. And actually with Zentangle you’re not drawing a thing.
It’s non representational, so you’re just drawing patterns and so you can’t do it wrong. If you can write the letters I, C, S and O. You can create any of the zentangle patterns and I promise you that that’s true.
So I have a free lesson on my website. So if you go to ivy-corner.com and then go to Freebies, you can find my free lesson, which is complete introduction to the Zentangle method.
And then I also have a beginner’s course and various other things if you want to delve a little bit deeper.
Becca
00:38:17.970 – 00:38:36.870
So, so for the free lesson, then what do I need to make it happen? Because I think me and the podcast listeners should absolutely make a pledge that we’re gonna try it.
We’re gonna try, even though we’re very busy today, we’re gonna try and take 10 minutes out. How much do we need 10 minutes, 30 minutes out of our day to do it? And what do I actually physically need to do it?
Do I just need a pen and a piece of paper?
Becky
00:38:36.870 – 00:39:09.440
Yeah, basically all you need is a pen and a pencil. There’s a thing called a tortillon which is like a rolled up paper stump if you don’t have one of those.
And you can get them off Amazon for quite cheap.
But if you don’t have one of those, you can use a cotton bud or your finger finger to smudge and create, smudge the pencil and create some shadows and shading. But yeah, like you can really do it with anything that you have to hand at home.
Some regular paper or like watercolor paper or just, you know, some regular paper or just, you know, watercolor paper would also work fine. But yeah, you really don’t need a lot of stuff to try it.
Becca
00:39:09.440 – 00:40:15.770
Okay, we’re up for the challenge, so I’m hoping some of the listeners are going to be up for the challenge too, because I really am terrible at drawing. Baking and drawing are the two things I am the worst at.
But I’m going to give it a go because I do know that it’s important for me to stop doing scrolling and to have some breaks. And today, particularly when we’re recording this, I’ve said to you I’m overwhelmed.
And I think that means on my lunch break I’m going to give this a go and whatever it looks like, I guarantee I will share the results. So if you are listening to this and you want to take up that challenge with me, then take a photo of it.
And if you don’t want to post it, send it to Becky, send it to me, and I’ll share all of the links to everything in the show. Notes Becky. It’s a Pleasure to have you on this podcast. As always, I’ve loved, loved seeing your journey through the ups and downs.
That’s like I said, what I love about working with people and being friends with people for such a long time and seeing how things evolve.
And I love that you’ve got this new creative part of your business that’s not only helping you, but it’s also continuing your mum’s legacy and helping you kind of find the success in the way that you want it. And I’m excited to see what’s next.
If people want to find out more, if they want to chat to you more, where’s the best places for them to find you for both your photography and your craft?
Becky
00:40:16.010 – 00:40:36.430
Well, generally I’m on Instagram for everything that the platform I post the most. So I’m for photography, Becky Harley Photography.
And for my new business, I’m Ivy’s Underscore Corner, Underscore Arts, and my website is Ivy’s Corner.com. i’m also on YouTube so you can hop onto there and subscribe and see lots of videos on there too.
Becca
00:40:36.430 – 00:40:51.530
Fantastic. Becky, you will be waiting, I’m sure, with bated breath to see the results of my first ever Zentangle.
I’m not feeling confident, but I promise you I will give it a go and I will let you know. Thank you so much for being here today and I hope to see you very soon. Soon.
Becky
00:40:51.530 – 00:40:53.330
Thank you so much, Becca. I’ll see you soon.
Becca
00:40:53.410 – 00:41:24.000
Such an interesting conversation. Was it with Becky?
I think one of the things we just think we don’t think about enough is burnout and overwhelm and how these things pile on top of us. And if you’re listening to this thinking, yeah, I’m suffering with some of those symptoms.
Yes, I feel like I’m disengaged and not connected with my business at the moment. It’s probably a sign to take a break and take some time out. So find something that you love.
Just take a step away because often taking a step back and getting back to a better mindset will actually make you more productive for the rest of the week. And wish me luck with my Zentangling. I’ll see you all next time.
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